China Does U-Turn, Lifts Ban On Websites 133
krou sends in a Guardian (UK) article reporting that overnight talks with the International Olympic Committee have resulted in the Chinese government lifting a ban on websites such as Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and the BBC Chinese language service "in Beijing, Shanghai and possibly further afield." Websites with information on the Falun Gong, Chinese dissidents, the Tibetan government in exile, and the 1989 military crackdown on the Tiananmen Square protests are still inaccessible. (We've been discussing Chinese Olympic censorship right along.) Quoting: "A spokesman for Amnesty International said: 'It's good news that our site has been unblocked in Olympic venues and perhaps elsewhere in Beijing, but it is still a long way from the "complete media freedom" promised. It seems public outrage has succeeded where the IOC's "quiet diplomacy" had failed.' Chinese engineers quoted in an article in the Atlantic Monthly said they had been told to prepare to unblock access for a list of specific internet protocol addresses to used by foreign visitors. But Andrew Lih, a new media author in Beijing, said it seemed the authorities might have simply decided it was easier to lift blocks for everyone. 'It's possible [to block individual locations] but would be very complicated,' he said."
U-Turn? (Score:5, Insightful)
That's no U-turn. At best, it's a hard left.
Re:U-Turn? (Score:5, Funny)
That's no U-turn. At best, it's a hard left.
So that's more like a L-turn then?
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Wonderful, these Olympics. (Score:1)
Uplifting humanity with entertainment and cooperation with the totalitarian oppresion with the worlds most populous state. Remember, the great firewall of China was designed and built by US Firms and it is being implemented everywhere else too. 2012 is the year all major ISPs will strangle the internet by making it look like a calbe TV subscription. [ning.com]
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And that's why I am able to get my Internet Service through Parallax [parallax.ws] , Oh wait...
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A surviving DSL company, what a cute little thing. I see they have managed to get around the ATT last mile block by using wireless. A whole two counties worth of freedom, I bet they get twice the usual inspection at the ATT splitters.
Then there is also Bridgemaxx [digitalbri...ations.com] and Verizon on top of Comcast. This is in little ol' Richmond, IN. On top of that, there is also Hughesnet, StarBand, and WildBlue. Despite your wild claims Twitter, America is not run by Comcast.
Re:U-Turn? (Score:4, Funny)
What do you mean?
We've always been at war with the Eurasians.
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Thank you for admitting that China is a rightwing paradise, the kind everyone is heading for by letting corporate mafiosos control our countries.
And for admitting that freedom is "left" of that kind of fascism on the political spectrum.
Anonymous Cowards have their uses, even if they don't realize it.
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So do Docs. But posting isn't one of them.
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It's no turn at all, the ban will be back as soon as the olympic games end. This is a minor PR move which has no long-term effect. I mean come on, we've seen complete bans on entire genres of media this year in China. Is that all okay because a couple of wankers from the west are allowed to freely browse during the olympics?
This is really irresponsible reporting.
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My father was in China some time ago, he said internet for business tuorists like him was "normal", but if you went out of your hotel, you started to have lots of restrictions.
I think it's the same here. Internet will be "semi-free" just for tourists, and -obviously- just for the olimpic games...
in short, nothing new...
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What about a big T for Totalitarian state.
The whole Olympic torch relay really summed it up, armed guards protecting the torch from protesters around the world showing the true face of authority in China, a group of thugs prepared to put down anyone or anything that gets in their way. Meanwhile our companies undermine what little democracy and freedom we have remaining with outsourcing and business policies that validate the way the Chinese government conducts
What better way? (Score:5, Insightful)
What better way to nail subversives ?
Let them convict themselves by allowing that whicvh is is deemed illegal in China ?
The Historical approach..
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(2) Profit!
(2) Remember which of your own citizens accessed dissedent material,keep tabs on 'em.
(3) After the Olympics leaves China consult the list of new dissidents.
(4) Have them quietly made into unpersons.
Interesting... (Score:5, Insightful)
Didn't they say they were going to spy on visitors' traffic too? Nothing about that here, maybe they're hoping we'll forget.
If I was going, I'd take tor [torproject.org] with me on my laptop. Also I'd buy a laptop first.
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Why Tor? (Score:5, Insightful)
The Chinese firewall doesn't block encrypted traffic. A far superior solution is to simply VPN to somewhere. That's what I do when traveling if I am in any location that I don't completely trust (airport or hotel network for example). I SSH to a server I have at home and tunnel traffic through the connection. It is then as though I was surfing at my house.
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yeah, but OpenSSH allows you to pick your desired key length, so if you're using your own setup it can be as secure as possible assuming customs didn't install a keylogger, or even notice your Linux partition.
--The FNP
You really think China can break AES? (Score:3, Informative)
That's what SSH (and most VPNs) use. It is the most tested cryptosystem in history. It has been signed off on by, well, everyone pretty much in the crypto field. After years of concerted effort, still no way to break it has been found.
Now if you want to life in AFDB land, go right ahead. However it seems extremely unlikely that anyone, much less the Chinese government, can break AES. As such, a VPN is a good solution.
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it seems extremely unlikely that anyone, much less the Chinese government, can break AES.
Why the "much less"? I would put China in the top 5 of countries I would expect to have the ability and desire to have a good go at breaking an algorithm.
Re:You really think China can break AES? (Score:4, Insightful)
Because they are new to the cryptography game and don't have the computing resources of many other countries. It seems extremely unlikely that even the NSA can break AES (given that they've certified it for top secret data) and when it comes to crypto, they are the best in the business. They are to information espionage what the KGB was to physical espionage. If I'd bet on anyone being able to figure out how to break a cryptosystem without anyone else knowing, the NSA would be my bet.
Regardless, my primary point is I find it extremely unlikely AES has been broken. It is an open algorithm that underwent an exceedingly rigorous selection process. Because of that, it was scrutinized. Once it was selected and made the official AES standard, it then underwent even more. As I said, it's the most tested cryptosystem out there. Thus far, it has held up wonderfully. So basically for a break to happen, there'd have to be a new field of math developed that would allow for some new way of attacking it. That seems very unlikely to happen, and I find it unlikely the MSS have already done so.
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Well, these days raw computing power is only one way of breaking crypto. In fact, I'd say that it would be the tool of last resort. Much more common is looking for mathematical flaws in the algorithms. And when it comes to raw talent in mathematics, I'd put China up there at the top of the heap with the NSA.
Remember that Chinese researchers are the ones that discovered collision weaknesses in MD
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Comment removed (Score:4, Informative)
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If anyone sends any sort of sensitive data, anywhere in the world, it should be encrypted.
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I confirm it! (Score:5, Funny)
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Who do you think you are? Netcraft?
More Accurately (Score:5, Informative)
China Does U-Turn, Lifts Ban On Certain Websites
Title is way too optimistic.
Chinese Government to populous: (Score:1, Insightful)
We are no longer filtering Western propaganda. We want to show you how corrupt the Westerners are and how they lie.
We are a peace loving people who love freedom and human rights. The Western Countries are saying bad things about us because they want to keep us down.
Now, considering how nationalistic the Chinese folks are and how they consider that they should in fact rule the World, and the PC folks out there who are offended easily (they like it because they like to bully people), I expect this post to b
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Nyoro~n :(
...waits for negative moderation...
Re:More Accurately (Score:4, Informative)
China Does U-Turn, Lifts Ban On Certain Websites
Title is way too optimistic.
Totally agree. As an expat Beijing resident with press connections the story moves by the day. Bottom line is that while generally open at the moment (i.e. in the Olympic press center) there are still sites that are blocked including a China blog at a major US news outlet. The Chinese generally allow VPN but if you go to certain sites you will still be stopped. Free proxy servers are tissue paper and generally not useful. The authorities, from observation and experience, can and do target individual computers. The Chinese are getting cleverer and more subtle at "shaping" the internet landscape and where you can go. Overall bottom line is that whatever little concessions might be made to the press center users the control of internet access will get worse not better. People who give credit to the Chinese for the access they have allowed are living in lalaland. The Chinese are grudging every concession and reneging whenever they can.
Facts instead of speculation (Score:4, Informative)
I configured Tor to use a Chinese exit node [quantenblog.net]. Here are my results:
- Chinese Wikipedia [wikipedia.org]: accessible (used to be blocked)
- BBC Chinese (via bbcchinese.com) [bbcchinese.com]: blocked
- BBC Chinese (via direct URL) [bbc.co.uk]: accessible
- Article on Tibet in English Wikipedia [wikipedia.org]: accessible (used to be blocked)
- Human Rights in China [hrichina.org]: blocked
Public outrage trumps diplomacy? (Score:2, Insightful)
You mean people actually doing something had more effect than other people talking about doing something? Color me shocked.
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China's Olympic ambitions falter with protests
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080802/ap_on_re_as/china_battered_hopes [yahoo.com]
said Wu Jiaxiang, a former government researcher and now a blogger and businessman. "We care less about human rights than other countries and more about sovereignty. That's bound to create an awkward feeling among other countries."
They just don't get it, do they...
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epic fail, to be sure.
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Every single one of the Chinese interviewed for that article needs to take a ride on the Waaaahmbulance. "Oh no, other countries are criticizing us, they don't like us, who's going to take us the prom now?" An entire country filled with teenage girls, just wonderful.
No one forced them to host the Olympics, no one forced them to open their borders to our media (and our disdain). The only good thing I can say about the Chinese at this point is, at least they're not Muslims, because then they'd be burning down
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Don't you think for a second that the communist party made sure no one who didn't perfectly toe the party line would be interviewed???
Unless there is **TOTAL** freedom of speech, not a single statement by anyone in China can be trusted.
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I can't imagine any worse torture than that. Your child was killed by a substandard building, put up by a corrupt government. And every month, you get a cash payment, a pension that reminds you of that fact. And it reminds you that instea
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An entire country filled with teenage girls, just wonderful... (...) ... The only good thing I can say about the Chinese at this point is, at least they're not Muslims, because then they'd be burning down embassies and strapping bombs to their chests.
Very insightful.
I have been spending much thoughts as well comparing the Muslims with the Chinese. Both have a gripe with the west. Both have an education that imprints on their citizens/believers on how the west and others (in the case of china, Japan; in the case of Muslims, Israel) are to be blamed for their people's situation.
Nevertheless, one big difference between these two peoples is that the Chinese believes in reciprocity and is eager to be integrated. On the other hand, Muslims completely lack und
Makes little difference (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm looking forward to the Olympic Games in North Korea 2012. Apparently, Kim Jong Il is expected to beat 52 world records.
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Re:Makes little difference (Score:4, Funny)
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Sold!
How to Lift a Ban For Commies (Score:3, Insightful)
2) Unban 3 of them
3) Claim the ban is lifted, as the other sites are only inaccessible
4) Fail!!!
Note: for those not familiar with the pun - For Dummies [wikipedia.org]
Tempest in a teapot (Score:5, Interesting)
Can everybody swallow the blue pill? (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm surprised none of the stories about this mention how easy it is to VPN out of China and thus bypass any blocks they throw up.
The problem is that ordinary citizens in China doesn't know what happen on Tiananmen Square in 1989. Do you seriously expect the average Chinese citizen to be able to get VPN out og China, and risk his/her life/career on it because the sites are illegal.
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seriously?
i guess i shouldn't be surprised, though.
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I'm surprised none of the stories about this mention how easy it is to VPN out of China and thus bypass any blocks they throw up.
The problem is that ordinary citizens in China doesn't know what happen on Tiananmen Square in 1989. Do you seriously expect the average Chinese citizen to be able to get VPN out og China, and risk his/her life/career on it because the sites are illegal.
The ordinary citizens in China (at least those over 20) know quite well what happened on Tiananmen in 1989,just talk to any Chinese cab driver.
Most Chinese don't think it has much relevance to today's business. While they agree the government in 1989 committed horrible crimes, hell it is two decades ago and both China and Chinese government has changed a lot [amazon.com]. Most of Chinese are happy with the current government [yahoo.com].
As for Tiananmen square most think it will resolve over time . Even a lot of 1989 demo
wish I have mod points (Score:2)
+1 on Informative
When I lived in China from 2003-06, I felt that every social issue there is so intrigue and inter-related that there's simply no solution than to wait out for population to shrink and grow economically prosperous on average. People I talked to about this issue generally have contradictory feelings -- on one hand they like the idea of "democracy" -- on the other they don't think it is the solution for China; they could point out failed examples like Mexico, India, Russia (under Yeltsin,) Phi
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Democracy is absolutely dependent on an educated populace. When people are illiterate and have no access to balanced information that shows both the good points and the bad points, it is totally illusory to think that Democracy may flourish.
Agree with this.
The Philippines have been bludgeoned for three centuries by the spanish into becoming a scatholic country
not quite agree with this. at most, just a small excuse. you already provided most of the reason for the Philippines in your first paragraph.
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You are right though, average citizen doesn't know what VPN is. Then again, same situa
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"Do you seriously expect the average Chinese citizen to be able to get VPN out og China, and risk...."
Why don't you use Firefox? I think, Firefox-3 is pretty cool and you must give it a try. It also highlights spelling mistakes like "og".
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Probably not. Which makes it easier to tag and pay even closer attempt to those that *do* use VPN's
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You're right that the average Chinese citizen can't VPN out. Not only do they not know how, but they don't have a box in the US to VPN to, don't realize what site it is they're missing, and possibly can't even read the English on the site anyways.
BUT, I've been living here for a year studying Chinese, and most of the Chinese people I've talked to DO know what happened in 1989. I mean, it wasn't even all that long ago. People would remember that kind of stuff, even if it wasn't discussed in their schoo
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Sometimes the "little stories" are probably not newsworthy as they are common occurrence.
I admit I haven't heard about the "little things" you mentioned, but regarding the one year imprisonment without trial, I think it's called "re-education through labour", and it's a weird kind of "administrative sanction" which happens always, so it wouldn't be much news to the Chinese people.
Chinese people are not as stupid as you think (Score:1)
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chinaman is not the preferred nomenclature.
The Dude... (Score:2)
The Dude: Walter, the chinaman who peed on my rug, I can't go give him a bill, so what the fuck are you talking about?
Walter Sobchak: What the fuck are you talking about? The chinaman is not the issue here, Dude. I'm talking about drawing a line in the sand, Dude. Across this line, you DO NOT... Also, Dude, chinaman is not the preferred nomenclature. Asian-American, please.
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We all believe Westerner are brain washed by their media.
And westerners believe the Chinese are brainwashed by their media.
Problem is, we're both right.
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iptables -A OUTPUT -s x.x.x.x/x -d x.x.x.x/x -j DROP
The above seems to work just fine, granted this is iptables but I would be very disappointed in CISCO if their switches/routers/firewalls couldn't support something as simple this. Makes me wonder if 'engineers' are just making up the difficulty level because they too are tired of this...
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If you don't see the connection between the Olympics and politics, then I'd be surprised if you had ever paid attention to the Olympics at all.
consistent inconsistencies (Score:2)
At least they are being consistent about being inconsistent.
NEWS FLASH: CHINA LISTENS TO WORD (Score:1)
See what a little pressure does to a country in the spotlight.
all we need now is some way to make the Tiananmen Square "incident" essential to reporting on the games
maybe that will count for something against the indoctrination of the chinese people
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All we need is a new Olympic Event -- Tank Pulling. See it's a "sporting event" and I'm sure every foreign reporter could get the parallels. (We may even get some highly memorable "parody" stills.)
--The FNP
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All we need is a new Olympic Event -- Tank Pulling. See it's a "sporting event" and I'm sure every foreign reporter could get the parallels. (We may even get some highly memorable "parody" stills.)
--The FNP
or, the "Tank Face Down"
attire is obviously a suit and briefcase...
how long will YOU last?
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Maybe, you are indoctrinated.
Read up on other posts by people who actually have been in China and spoken to the people there.
Reporting on an incident which is almost history as "news" is just idiotic. It should be on history books, and taught as such, not as a political tool for anybody, including you.
IOC Negotiation Strategy 1a (Score:2)
Whenever it faces a country big enough, strong enough or mean enough to stand up to it, the brave men of the IOC have a standard negotiation strategy that can best be summed up as "I'll blow you now. You can pay me back later."
To absolutely nobody's surprise, the IOC is still waiting for its first oral experience that doesn't involve gargling with 3 gallons of Listerine afterward.
Sure, The Leopard Can Change it Spots (Score:3, Insightful)
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Sad thing is that western countries desire to be like them. (censorship)
Why is some temporary window dressing important? (Score:2)
And the public outrage won't be any more evident than it was before. It's only one billion or so PRC citizens being kept in the dark, not several hundred reporters.
Pressure Works (Score:2)
This small advance for freedom (for some privileged people) in a tiny sector of China (in Beijing) for a brief, extraordinary period (while the whole world is watching) is better than nothing. And it's the result of pressure on China's mafia government by people who expect freedom, and won't accept less. Not even in a tiny sector for a brief, extraordinary period.
This tiny victory might not last long at all. But it does prove that there's at least one way it can be done.
Now the harder part is finding the ot
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No, I have done quite a lot to stop both China's mafia government and the US mafia government. One doesn't cancel the other: they each make it twice as bad.
What have you done to stop either, other than whine about the US mafia government (as a lame excuse for China's mafia government)? Anonymous hypocrite Coward.
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As I said, one doesn't cancel the other. "Twice" is obviously not a mathematical expression in that statement. And there aren't real body counts in either China's or the US' mass murders.
You are all naive (Score:1)
If you haven't already noticed, China has a habit of promising not to do something, then going and doing it anyway. What makes you think this time is any different? It'd be just like them to turn it off anyway just before the games start.
It's amazing how easily Western politicians and bureaucrats are duped.
Hook, Line and Sinker (Score:1)
"But the IOC warned that while these sites may be accessible to journalists in Beijing, the rest of the country would still be subject to China's filtered version of the Internet. Additionally, certain types of sites will remain blocked across all of China, including porn and those that are considered "subversive" or against national interests (such as sites related to the Falun Gong and
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In fact, my impression of the habit of the Chinese government (in the past, say, 30 years) is that they usually deliver what they promised.
I really can't say the same of western politicians.
Prove me wrong?
Let One Thousand Flowers Bloom (Score:1)
I think what could be happening here is a short program to appease foreign countries while the Olympics take place, and where thought-criminals will be identified by their web-surfing behavior.
It's a trap (Score:1)
I'll believe it when I see full retraction of internet bans.
They're just trying to look good for the press, just like in all the other stories about china lately.
http://www.freeproxyserver.ca/ (Score:1)
I think most people realise that as soon as the games are over any lifted restrictions will go straight back on.
However, I was was in China for 3 months from January to April and found http://www.freeproxyserver.ca/ [freeproxyserver.ca] to work fine with all websites I tried it on.
I'll be going back for another 4 months in October so I hope it's still working.
Cheers,
Alex